Thomas Mercer-Hursh thinks my numbers are suspect. Could be, I'm just guessing, but to be clear, they're based on Dave's assertion that he includes EVERYTHING in that $10/bottle figure... [See prior diary pages and Brendan's article with a few additions from Dave.] Brendan, the wine pickers, mortgage, everything (though I think I know he isn't including the new building and a few other things, but let's take him at his word). Long term it gives him an income, give or take that lets him live in the style which he prefers, which includes some toys I'd really like! (-: If I only had a winery sized living room.
I like the point about the cost of coffee. I don't hear much in the way of complaints about coffee, and not being a coffee drinker I can't relate to what it costs to make a good cup of coffee at home. But my wife tells me that the home/retail price of a GOOD cup of coffee is about $.30. I've got a *feeling* that a restaurant pays about half that, but of course they also tend to give you refills. So let's say 3 refills makes the cost of coffee (not including peripherals like sugar and cream, but then not everybody gets 3 refills so maybe it evens out) about $.45, hell, let's make it $.50. Now the fancy place I eat at charges $2.50 for that service. Markup being 5 times. Even in the almost all the other most expensive joints, we're talking about 3 times RETAIL markup on wine (which , as Dave points out, is a lot MORE markup up since restaurants don't pay retail for their wine); which, I guess, means that maybe wine and coffee are marked up about the same.
Now what I seem to see in restaurants is a lot more people drinking coffee than wine and or coffee AND wine. PROFIT that isn't really from the "food."
Interestingly enough, while looking for something completely different, I ran across a website dedicated to restaurants and wine. One of the articles talks about a hotel selling wine in their restaurant at cost+$10. That's great, but the problem is they clearly point out that the only reason they can afford to do it is because they can make their profit on the "rooms" side while a restaurant cannot.
Now Thomas would (theoretically if it works) like to increase the price of the food and lower the price of the wine. Well in the local fancy place I frequent that would make the entrees about $28. That's about double since I started eating there 10 years ago. Isn't that more than the cost of inflation (?) and if it is, then the profit goes down anyhow. In any event the $23 entrees were starting to really get out my league...
So it looks like Ed Hale and I are on the same wavelength... Let the wealthy (and the fools) provide the profit for the restaurant when they pay for wine (and coffee?) so that we can still go out and get some really GOOD food at "acceptable" prices. STOP paying restaurants AND wineries ridiculous prices on wines. There is a lot of good wine out there at "reasonable" prices.
I'm unaware of really "fancy" places that don't also serve wine and other profit center items, so where Ed Hale asks where do they hide their increased costs, I don't know.... Which restaurants are these? And are they charging REALLY high food prices?
But mostly it sounds like Ed and I are on the same wavelength, go for the food and not the wine. Build a cellar and have great wine at home. For the adventurous, cook at home.
Listen, off the subject, it seems like just about everybody buys store bought tomatoes which are essentially unripened, green tomatoes gassed to make them red, no better than end of season green tomatoes only good for making fried green side dishes. And the cost of these atrocities in my local store seems to have quadrupled in the last year or so. Seems to me we all have to spell P-R-O-F-I-T.
I'm still waiting for a chef and/or restaruanteur to give us some straight facts on how all this works, I happen to know that in MY special place that I'm getting better food there because they charge more for the wine (which I don't pay for). And I guess I'm also waiting to hear why somebody shouldn't decide to put the profit they make in the wine and not the food.... In my case (not paying for the wine), it works to my benefit, but even were that not so, it is the restaurant's choice. If all things were equal as to food of course I would pick the 50% markup place over the 300% markup place, but in my experience, the food isn't equal... Eating *out* to me is more food than wine....
REPLY TO THIS MESSAGE START A NEW THREAD
Restaurant Wine Pricing
Mark Brown, April 2, 2001
Re: Restaurant Wine Pricing
Ed Hale, April 3, 2001Re: Restaurant Wine Pricing
A. Simpcox, April 3, 2001Re: Restaurant Wine Pricing
Thomas Mercer-Hursh, April 7, 2001
Re: Restaurant Wine Pricing
Ed Hale, April 4, 2001
Re: Restaurant Wine Pricing
A. Simpcox, April 3, 2001
Re: Restaurant Wine Pricing
Ed Hale, April 7, 2001Re: Restaurant Wine Pricing
A. Simpcox, April 7, 2001
Re: Restaurant Wine Pricing
Ed Hale, April 9, 2001
Re: Restaurant Wine Pricing
Fernando Divina, August 1, 2001RETURN